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Seahorses
- Thread starter calaxa
- Start date
Hmm, I'm certainly open minded and will continue to keep a close eye on it. If things take a turn for the worse I'll try to be quick to find better homes for them. I only got the male because the female was doing so well.
My take so far on the [three?] areas of greatest concern are:
1) food, I was target feeding with success, and can go back to it, but the female is aggressive enough to not require it and eats plenty. We make sure we see her eating every day, so not sure what can go wrong in the future there. The male I'm more concerned about given his habits. My solution there is to add a refugium to make sure the copepods are a-plenty. My research suggests that copepods and such are a more natural food source for these than mysis or (enriched) brine. So as long as I can provide enough, he should be ok for nutrition, no? (PS, I do soak my mysis in vitamins before I feed).
2) competitors in the community. I think the fact that I have relatively few fish, and a large tank with lots of hiding places helps. But I'll keep a close eye on it. I imagine that only the blue tang and clowns could really ultimately cause trouble. But so far, like I said, they don't bother them at all. And gobies, gramma and dartfish keep to themselves. But I'll keep close tabs.
3) flow. This one I feel the least knowledgeable about. But so far like I mentioned they keep to certain areas of lower flow, and on occassion when they venture out into the higher flow areas, they seem to navigate it just fine. Are two Koralia 4's for a 180 really too much for them you think? They're certainly not out in front of the powerheads, and I've deliberately set their "hitching posts" in the dead spots.
Anyway, I had researched them a good bit, and stayed away for a while, but my tipping point towards the positive was when in two successive state aquarium (I've recently visited Camden's, Baltimore's, New Orleans among others) visits I saw set ups that included seahorses in community tanks that looked similar in composition to mine. So I decided to give it a try, figuring that as long as I was able to make sure they fed properly, the rest could be managed. But I'll keep updating and am definitely open to suggestions.
My take so far on the [three?] areas of greatest concern are:
1) food, I was target feeding with success, and can go back to it, but the female is aggressive enough to not require it and eats plenty. We make sure we see her eating every day, so not sure what can go wrong in the future there. The male I'm more concerned about given his habits. My solution there is to add a refugium to make sure the copepods are a-plenty. My research suggests that copepods and such are a more natural food source for these than mysis or (enriched) brine. So as long as I can provide enough, he should be ok for nutrition, no? (PS, I do soak my mysis in vitamins before I feed).
2) competitors in the community. I think the fact that I have relatively few fish, and a large tank with lots of hiding places helps. But I'll keep a close eye on it. I imagine that only the blue tang and clowns could really ultimately cause trouble. But so far, like I said, they don't bother them at all. And gobies, gramma and dartfish keep to themselves. But I'll keep close tabs.
3) flow. This one I feel the least knowledgeable about. But so far like I mentioned they keep to certain areas of lower flow, and on occassion when they venture out into the higher flow areas, they seem to navigate it just fine. Are two Koralia 4's for a 180 really too much for them you think? They're certainly not out in front of the powerheads, and I've deliberately set their "hitching posts" in the dead spots.
Anyway, I had researched them a good bit, and stayed away for a while, but my tipping point towards the positive was when in two successive state aquarium (I've recently visited Camden's, Baltimore's, New Orleans among others) visits I saw set ups that included seahorses in community tanks that looked similar in composition to mine. So I decided to give it a try, figuring that as long as I was able to make sure they fed properly, the rest could be managed. But I'll keep updating and am definitely open to suggestions.
Oh sorry, and I forgot temperature.
I used to be very concerned about my "high" temperatures and was looking into getting a chiller etc. But the more I read, the more it sounds like the topic was very much under debate, and several knowledgeable hobbyists and professionals out there suggest 82 degree and even higher temps might be ok, if not preferable for most reef dwelling animals. Granted that might not suit the seahorses in particular. But again, so far, all I can say is that now fish, seahorse or coral has had problems that I can make out. Do you think temperature could have a long term negative effect? Or just not the ideal that the seahorses in particular are used to? My gut was that as long as it wasn't fluctuating much it should be ok.
I used to be very concerned about my "high" temperatures and was looking into getting a chiller etc. But the more I read, the more it sounds like the topic was very much under debate, and several knowledgeable hobbyists and professionals out there suggest 82 degree and even higher temps might be ok, if not preferable for most reef dwelling animals. Granted that might not suit the seahorses in particular. But again, so far, all I can say is that now fish, seahorse or coral has had problems that I can make out. Do you think temperature could have a long term negative effect? Or just not the ideal that the seahorses in particular are used to? My gut was that as long as it wasn't fluctuating much it should be ok.
82* is fine for our reefs and the TYPICAL animals that we keep. Seahorses are ... a horse of a different color! They need temps in the mid-70s. So if you target feed daily, and keep the other bioload low and have areas of low flow for them and plenty of stick like things for them to hang out in... if your temps are in the 80s they are not going to be able to survive. It is like putting you in a 120* oven and saying that you'll be fine!
When I first started the hobby many years ago I kept only fish. I had a nice community tank going and added a large black seahorse. It got along fine but had to be target fed. One day it gave birth and the other fish picked them off 1 by 1. The fish learned where fresh food was coming from and would constantly attack it's pouch. The seahorse ended up with an air bubble and swam on it's side in circles. Despite all my efforts to help it the poor thing died. So as everyone has been saying a separate setup would be so much better.
Thanks Phyllis. Though interestingly ORA on its website says it keeps its tropical seahorses in temperatures ranging from 75-85. And I understand Reidi have a pretty broad ranging geographic spread up past the equator, so I thought they'd be a safer bet. In other research pieces its been noted that the greater diversity of tropical seahorses are in the warmer areas (and that the lower temp tropics and temperates had fewer thriving species), so that also gave me comfort when I was looking in to them. Are there signs I should look for of temperature having a negative impact?
Mav, thats a shame. I could see how that would or could happen though. I'm not trying to breed them, but if they did choose to, I would then buy and move them to a different tank. I knew there'd be a likelyhood of the fry being eaten if they bred and I didn't move them, it never occured to me that the fish would go after the fry source too. But that makes sense.
Mav, thats a shame. I could see how that would or could happen though. I'm not trying to breed them, but if they did choose to, I would then buy and move them to a different tank. I knew there'd be a likelyhood of the fry being eaten if they bred and I didn't move them, it never occured to me that the fish would go after the fry source too. But that makes sense.
First off seahorses are not reef dwelling creatures so keeping them in a reef set up is not natural for them. They are not accustomed to the high temps and flow rates that a reef environment has.
Now the main reason for the lower temperatures is to keep bacterial levels to manageable levels. Yes reidi come from natural temps in the upper 70's to low 80's but their natural environment is compiled of millions of gallons of water to dilute the bacterial levels. Seahorses are very susceptible to bacterial infections, bacteria breed rampantly at higher temperatures. Keeping the temps lower causes the bacteria to reproduce at a slower rate. At the lowered rate a healthy seahorse can fight most bacterias off naturally. At the higher temperatures and with inappropriate tank mates stressing them, the seahorses are highly prone to a bacterial infection which could be deadly and requires the quick administration of antibiotics. Warning signs can include; lethargy, loss of appetite, rapid breathing, lying on their side, bubbles on/under the skin, ulcers and sudden death. Sometimes you will see one, multiple, all or none of these signs.
I see it on a regular basis where people try to keep seahorses at reef temperatures and the results are never good.
As for what ORA says about keeping their seahorses at higher temps I would take that with a grain of salt. ORA does not have a great track record with breeding seahorses. Fish and corals yes, but not seahorses. I have had to help many a people treat their ORA horses for infections due to the higher temps ORA raises/keeps them at.
Also if you have a male and a female in the same tank they will 99.9% of the time breed.
Now the main reason for the lower temperatures is to keep bacterial levels to manageable levels. Yes reidi come from natural temps in the upper 70's to low 80's but their natural environment is compiled of millions of gallons of water to dilute the bacterial levels. Seahorses are very susceptible to bacterial infections, bacteria breed rampantly at higher temperatures. Keeping the temps lower causes the bacteria to reproduce at a slower rate. At the lowered rate a healthy seahorse can fight most bacterias off naturally. At the higher temperatures and with inappropriate tank mates stressing them, the seahorses are highly prone to a bacterial infection which could be deadly and requires the quick administration of antibiotics. Warning signs can include; lethargy, loss of appetite, rapid breathing, lying on their side, bubbles on/under the skin, ulcers and sudden death. Sometimes you will see one, multiple, all or none of these signs.
I see it on a regular basis where people try to keep seahorses at reef temperatures and the results are never good.
As for what ORA says about keeping their seahorses at higher temps I would take that with a grain of salt. ORA does not have a great track record with breeding seahorses. Fish and corals yes, but not seahorses. I have had to help many a people treat their ORA horses for infections due to the higher temps ORA raises/keeps them at.
Also if you have a male and a female in the same tank they will 99.9% of the time breed.
i saw a commercial for that "prego.... it's in there"