Interested to know if anyone has a Seneye (http://www.seneye.com/), what they think of it. Among other things, it is a PAR meter, which seems good for costing less than $200. I think I'm going to order one.
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Seneye - Anyone have one?
- Thread starter jpelzer
- Start date
Looks like it has some interesting features. However, you need to buy the "slide packs" though which are $112 for a years supply... every year. 
I just purchased... I bought 3-months worth of the slide packs. Though I don't think you need them in order to use the PAR meter. I think that's their way to give away the razor and sell the blades, but it also gives you a nice web UI for a bunch of stats. In any case, I just ordered one, I'll post my findings. Also, I found a code on the net: "20off2days" which seems to work, 20% off. Shipping was $30 though, from the UK.
Heres a review i posted a while back on another reef site. To all those that dont know what it is heres a brief overview..
"Seneye is a new water monitoring device . Seneye works by dropping a digital all-in-one monitor into your water that reports a wide variety of parameters and controls them as well. "Seneye believes its products are a massive step forward in animal welfare, allowing any fishkeeper to monitor invisible pollution in aquariums or ponds. The revolutionary product constantly monitors, among other parameters, free ammonia (NH3), pH, water level, temperature, LUX, Kelvin and PAR. Importantly, the Seneye controller utlizes predictive software, warning owners before a dreaded aquarium crash. The device is available with a USB for connection to a PC as well as an optional USB power adapter, allowing it can work autonomously. The results are relayed to the customer's computer and uploaded to their on-line web space. Alerts are sent to the customer via text messages and e-mail allowing for remote monitoring. The sophisticated software analyses the results and raises a warning when parameters stray from the norm, as well as recommending corrective actions."
The best part of Seneye is that it suggests and recommends actions when it detects something astray or not quite right. There will be three main models available at launch in July including a seneye Home, seneye Pond and seneye Reef version that offers different options depending on the device. You'll have access to a mobile version of Seneye that allows you to remotely monitor your aquarium perimeters and even report on them, address key deficiencies in your reef tank. The monitoring plan called Seneye+ is priced at around $8/monthly.
The seneye Reef features include:
Automatically monitors multiple key parameters
Constantly watching your aquarium, 5600 readings per month
Get healthier coral using the integrated LUX, Kelvin and PAR light meter
Early warning, intelligent software predicts future water conditions
Convenient alerts sent to e-mail and mobile phone
Access results worldwide, data stored online for easy viewing
Track your results with automatic graphing
Connect to a PC or optional USB power adaptor"
So i decided on one of these primarily to try out the par meter since im switching to LEDS soon.I wanted to be able to take PAR measurements from my current lighting setup and match them with my new setup and then gradually increase/decrease based on coral needs. I think measuring these parameters first is a good way to ensure a smooth transition. I was going to invest in a Apogee PAR meter but when i read about this i thought it may be a better/cheaper alternative. In addition the seneye is slightly better for measuring light in reef tanks .
Well i got it the mail the other day along with the floatation apparatus(this is great to use if you cant make use of the suction cup and/or need to get accurate readings from the light meter)
Heres some pics of the mount options
Suction
Floatation
The instructions are sparse but most reefers should be able to trudge through however most users would definitely benefit from additional documentation. The most important piece for users who plan to use this as an aquarium monitors are the slides that monitors ph and ammonia they must be presoaked in tank water for at least 24 hours however Many reefers are recommending soaking at least for 48 hours to ensure better accuracy. These slides must be activated in order to view any results for PH,ammonia and the results are then uploaded to the dashboard interface for review. These slides are only good for one month and then have to be replaced. They cost about 10 buck per slide. The company says this was done to prevent the need for calibration. The cost also includes the ability to upload to their "cloud" and view the data from any web browser. You can also receive email and text message alerts if your parameters go out of whack. I also heard that within 6 months the device will also monitor Nitrates, Nitrites, Chlorine, Carbonate Hardness and General Hardness.
Heres a look at my dashboard (the dotted blue line is reading from my tank)
My initial install of the software went less than smoothly. I encountered issues accessing my dashboard account and using the light meter(it was initially disabled by the software) but i sent an email to the support address and Tom coswell at seneye was extremely fast and helpful in resolving these issues. So i have to give an A+ for customer service. But i have to point out that in order to use this monitor effectively it must be connected to a PC 24/7 in order to upload the results to the seneye cloud. This method of monitoring just isnt realistic on most tanks. However the company has hinted at a wireless solution that will be able to do this without the need for a connected PC. Unfortunately this solution wont be available for at least another 6 months(according to reports). In the meantime if you cant have it plugged into your PC you can plug the seneye into any usb power adapter and the devices will continue to take and store readings.Once your able to plug the device back into your PC it will automatically upload these readings and then you can view them from your dashboard.
Well the most important reason for me purchasing this device was the light meter so on to the results. I took some readings with all of my lights on (Halide,T5 and leds approximately 10" off the surface)
Well i was satisfied with the readings but i can only hope that theyre accurate as i dont have another meter to compare it with. I also am curious as to why i dont get a kelvin reading when the halide is on (only with the T5 and LEDs) but its not really a big deal as long is get the PAR and LUX for now..
So overall its a pretty cool device but definitely has room for improvement.(Which i guess is ok since the device is still in beta) Hopefully the developers take in all the feedback and improve on what should be a really awesome addition to any aquarium. For now i would recommend this device to any one looking for a competitively priced PAR meter. In the future it should be a reliable way to view key water parameters without the need for daily testing(In addition to being alerted if they go out of whack) The biggest drawback is the need to have the device connected to a PC to upload data. So my advice to anyone wanting to take advantage of the water monitoring would be to wait for the wireless adapter update that would alleviate the need for a PC connection.
My ratings
Design:7
Features:6(will be upgraded to a 9 once all additional features are released)
Customer Service:10
Price:7
Performance:7
Overall:7 (For now)
"Seneye is a new water monitoring device . Seneye works by dropping a digital all-in-one monitor into your water that reports a wide variety of parameters and controls them as well. "Seneye believes its products are a massive step forward in animal welfare, allowing any fishkeeper to monitor invisible pollution in aquariums or ponds. The revolutionary product constantly monitors, among other parameters, free ammonia (NH3), pH, water level, temperature, LUX, Kelvin and PAR. Importantly, the Seneye controller utlizes predictive software, warning owners before a dreaded aquarium crash. The device is available with a USB for connection to a PC as well as an optional USB power adapter, allowing it can work autonomously. The results are relayed to the customer's computer and uploaded to their on-line web space. Alerts are sent to the customer via text messages and e-mail allowing for remote monitoring. The sophisticated software analyses the results and raises a warning when parameters stray from the norm, as well as recommending corrective actions."
The best part of Seneye is that it suggests and recommends actions when it detects something astray or not quite right. There will be three main models available at launch in July including a seneye Home, seneye Pond and seneye Reef version that offers different options depending on the device. You'll have access to a mobile version of Seneye that allows you to remotely monitor your aquarium perimeters and even report on them, address key deficiencies in your reef tank. The monitoring plan called Seneye+ is priced at around $8/monthly.
The seneye Reef features include:
Automatically monitors multiple key parameters
Constantly watching your aquarium, 5600 readings per month
Get healthier coral using the integrated LUX, Kelvin and PAR light meter
Early warning, intelligent software predicts future water conditions
Convenient alerts sent to e-mail and mobile phone
Access results worldwide, data stored online for easy viewing
Track your results with automatic graphing
Connect to a PC or optional USB power adaptor"
So i decided on one of these primarily to try out the par meter since im switching to LEDS soon.I wanted to be able to take PAR measurements from my current lighting setup and match them with my new setup and then gradually increase/decrease based on coral needs. I think measuring these parameters first is a good way to ensure a smooth transition. I was going to invest in a Apogee PAR meter but when i read about this i thought it may be a better/cheaper alternative. In addition the seneye is slightly better for measuring light in reef tanks .
Well i got it the mail the other day along with the floatation apparatus(this is great to use if you cant make use of the suction cup and/or need to get accurate readings from the light meter)
Heres some pics of the mount options
Suction
Floatation
The instructions are sparse but most reefers should be able to trudge through however most users would definitely benefit from additional documentation. The most important piece for users who plan to use this as an aquarium monitors are the slides that monitors ph and ammonia they must be presoaked in tank water for at least 24 hours however Many reefers are recommending soaking at least for 48 hours to ensure better accuracy. These slides must be activated in order to view any results for PH,ammonia and the results are then uploaded to the dashboard interface for review. These slides are only good for one month and then have to be replaced. They cost about 10 buck per slide. The company says this was done to prevent the need for calibration. The cost also includes the ability to upload to their "cloud" and view the data from any web browser. You can also receive email and text message alerts if your parameters go out of whack. I also heard that within 6 months the device will also monitor Nitrates, Nitrites, Chlorine, Carbonate Hardness and General Hardness.
Heres a look at my dashboard (the dotted blue line is reading from my tank)
My initial install of the software went less than smoothly. I encountered issues accessing my dashboard account and using the light meter(it was initially disabled by the software) but i sent an email to the support address and Tom coswell at seneye was extremely fast and helpful in resolving these issues. So i have to give an A+ for customer service. But i have to point out that in order to use this monitor effectively it must be connected to a PC 24/7 in order to upload the results to the seneye cloud. This method of monitoring just isnt realistic on most tanks. However the company has hinted at a wireless solution that will be able to do this without the need for a connected PC. Unfortunately this solution wont be available for at least another 6 months(according to reports). In the meantime if you cant have it plugged into your PC you can plug the seneye into any usb power adapter and the devices will continue to take and store readings.Once your able to plug the device back into your PC it will automatically upload these readings and then you can view them from your dashboard.
Well the most important reason for me purchasing this device was the light meter so on to the results. I took some readings with all of my lights on (Halide,T5 and leds approximately 10" off the surface)
Well i was satisfied with the readings but i can only hope that theyre accurate as i dont have another meter to compare it with. I also am curious as to why i dont get a kelvin reading when the halide is on (only with the T5 and LEDs) but its not really a big deal as long is get the PAR and LUX for now..
So overall its a pretty cool device but definitely has room for improvement.(Which i guess is ok since the device is still in beta) Hopefully the developers take in all the feedback and improve on what should be a really awesome addition to any aquarium. For now i would recommend this device to any one looking for a competitively priced PAR meter. In the future it should be a reliable way to view key water parameters without the need for daily testing(In addition to being alerted if they go out of whack) The biggest drawback is the need to have the device connected to a PC to upload data. So my advice to anyone wanting to take advantage of the water monitoring would be to wait for the wireless adapter update that would alleviate the need for a PC connection.
My ratings
Design:7
Features:6(will be upgraded to a 9 once all additional features are released)
Customer Service:10
Price:7
Performance:7
Overall:7 (For now)
It definitely has alot of potential. Heres another writeup i did after comparing it with an apogee PAR meter:
"I was really surprised and happy to see they are extremely close.
(test were taken under halide/T5)
Seneye:Yellow
Apogee:Red
I can now totally recommend the seneye as an accurate and in some cases cheaper alternative to the apogee par meter. It also gives you the added measurements of kelvin, lux and a spectral graph..... Thanks again to fnard for allowing me to use his meter for testing."
"I was really surprised and happy to see they are extremely close.
(test were taken under halide/T5)
Seneye:Yellow
Apogee:Red
I can now totally recommend the seneye as an accurate and in some cases cheaper alternative to the apogee par meter. It also gives you the added measurements of kelvin, lux and a spectral graph..... Thanks again to fnard for allowing me to use his meter for testing."
So I've had my Seneye running for about a month. It's OK, not great.
The Good:
Accuracy:
Alerting:
The Good:
- Cheap PAR meter (seems accurate)
Accuracy:
- The pH is always off vs a calibrated probe (by about 2/10ths)
- The temperature was also off by about 2 degrees
Alerting:
- I had a power outage last Friday, which caused my heat to drop below threshold, and then my vinegar pump came on and stayed on dosing the pH below threshold. Neither caused an alert email to be sent, even though the Seneye is directly connected to a computer all the time.
Hey jason my seneye has the same exact inaccuracies with temp and PH. The only reason why i trust the seneye PAR meter is because i tested it side by side with an apogee meter.
I'm bringing a Seneye Reef to the meeting, and I have a great introductory price for the club as well, so don't buy till you try! LOL! I've been in contact with the guys over at Seneye quite regularly (I'm kind of a pain in the butt that way, but they have been great answering all my petty questions) because I didn't want to offer something new like this up until I had thoroughly tested it myself.
The Seneye DOES have to be in a high flow area of the tank/sump to get accurate readings. Because it is not using a lab grade probe, rather, it uses a proprietary testing slide, there can be some slight inaccuracies with the PH reading and the temp reading. But, this is why the software takes readings every 30 minutes, and the online access graphs out your readings over the life of the slide, and also gives you average readings and trends as well.
I've tested it out in both a running 75 gallon tank and my 30 gallon tank, and what I've found is it does seem to function better in larger water volumes with higher flow.
At any rate, if you're coming to the meeting, check it out for yourself, and right after the meeting, I'll let everyone know what the price is going to be on these! I think you'll be happy with it!
The Seneye DOES have to be in a high flow area of the tank/sump to get accurate readings. Because it is not using a lab grade probe, rather, it uses a proprietary testing slide, there can be some slight inaccuracies with the PH reading and the temp reading. But, this is why the software takes readings every 30 minutes, and the online access graphs out your readings over the life of the slide, and also gives you average readings and trends as well.
I've tested it out in both a running 75 gallon tank and my 30 gallon tank, and what I've found is it does seem to function better in larger water volumes with higher flow.
At any rate, if you're coming to the meeting, check it out for yourself, and right after the meeting, I'll let everyone know what the price is going to be on these! I think you'll be happy with it!
Their site/service leaves a lot to be desired right now (fixable though):
So, 2 weeks of data there, where the temperature is incredibly stable (2 degree difference between highest and lowest), but the site is saying 'Caution in 11 hours'... It ALWAYS says caution in x hours. Always. For both temperature and pH. Useless.
I'm still hoping they'll fix the issues, it's got a lot of promise. The PAR meter seems accurate, and because of that I still recommend folks get one, if that's what they're looking for. Right now, the other functions are just broken... I mean, wrong temperature, wrong pH, that means that it can't give you correct NH4 readings. It fails there, except that I do believe that it correctly tells me pH is rising or falling or higher than usual. Except that right now alerts don't work. Argh.
- As mentioned, alerts don't seem to be firing correctly
- 'Trending' logic is totally flawed. Here's an example:
So, 2 weeks of data there, where the temperature is incredibly stable (2 degree difference between highest and lowest), but the site is saying 'Caution in 11 hours'... It ALWAYS says caution in x hours. Always. For both temperature and pH. Useless.I'm still hoping they'll fix the issues, it's got a lot of promise. The PAR meter seems accurate, and because of that I still recommend folks get one, if that's what they're looking for. Right now, the other functions are just broken... I mean, wrong temperature, wrong pH, that means that it can't give you correct NH4 readings. It fails there, except that I do believe that it correctly tells me pH is rising or falling or higher than usual. Except that right now alerts don't work. Argh.
Hey Jason:
I looked at your image. (And I've spoken with Matt over at Seneye several times on the alerts, as well as the lag time between the device readings and the update to the website, mine always seems to be 1 or 2 readings behind on the website).
I had a similar issue with the temperature. What seems to be happening is the software is trending out to the future for its potential alerts. Your temp seems to always be riding pretty close to that bottom threshold of 75 degrees, so the software is going to calculate based on previous readings and what it EXPECTS to see in the future (note that the software is indicating that your trend in temp is going down), that is why yours always says caution in 11 hours, but the caution never actually comes.
I also know that they are beta testing a new version of the software as we speak that should correct some of the algorithmic errors in relation to the cautions and trending.
Again, not a perfect piece of equipment, it has its flaws (mostly in the reporting software), but it also is a $180 piece of equipment too.
Do you have the device in the display or in the sump?
What is the unit positioned near? (IE: outlet from a skimmer can toss off the readings a bit, as well as having it too far from the highest flow point in your tank, or having it too close to a heater)
I've noticed that I get different readings if I move it from my sump to my display (my sump is very low flow, only running about a 400gph return pump because of the refugium)
I looked at your image. (And I've spoken with Matt over at Seneye several times on the alerts, as well as the lag time between the device readings and the update to the website, mine always seems to be 1 or 2 readings behind on the website).
I had a similar issue with the temperature. What seems to be happening is the software is trending out to the future for its potential alerts. Your temp seems to always be riding pretty close to that bottom threshold of 75 degrees, so the software is going to calculate based on previous readings and what it EXPECTS to see in the future (note that the software is indicating that your trend in temp is going down), that is why yours always says caution in 11 hours, but the caution never actually comes.
I also know that they are beta testing a new version of the software as we speak that should correct some of the algorithmic errors in relation to the cautions and trending.
Again, not a perfect piece of equipment, it has its flaws (mostly in the reporting software), but it also is a $180 piece of equipment too.
Do you have the device in the display or in the sump?
What is the unit positioned near? (IE: outlet from a skimmer can toss off the readings a bit, as well as having it too far from the highest flow point in your tank, or having it too close to a heater)
I've noticed that I get different readings if I move it from my sump to my display (my sump is very low flow, only running about a 400gph return pump because of the refugium)
Yeah, I don't think the temperature warning is due to being close to the threshold, pH does the same thing:
The sensor is in my DT, back wall. It gets decent flow there, heaters and all that sort of fun are far away. Their algorithms are just wrong. You can tell their whole site was developed off-shore, they're not a tech company per se. So they're telling some software shop in Ukraine or India or China "make it show graphs" and they make it show graphs, but the devs are not fish keepers, so the exact product reasons for certain things are getting lost in translation. Other examples are the graphs don't give the units they're measuring in... ppm? Maybe. Give them enough time, they'll fix it.
Their bigger problem is a lack of transparency. They don't have any forums or 'real' FAQs available. Their FAQ is a marketing FAQ. And maybe that's fine, many other companies in the industry kind of sneak by that way, like those snake-oil companies that sell magnetic 'water conditioners' (that do absolutely nothing). But it'd be bad if Seneye went that route, they really should be soliciting input to fix their product, and giving some insight into their process... Like when the new sensors will be available. Will the slides I have now still be useful then, or will I need to discard my current slides and use the new ones? That sort of simple thing, they just don't communicate.
I think it's basically a decent device, the PAR meter is worth it, the other sensors are substandard, but if it shows your pH dropping, your pH *IS* dropping, just don't trust the actual numeric reading, same for temperature, same for NH4, and probably same for the other parameters they say it will eventually support. It's not absolutely accurate, but relative, it's good.
The sensor is in my DT, back wall. It gets decent flow there, heaters and all that sort of fun are far away. Their algorithms are just wrong. You can tell their whole site was developed off-shore, they're not a tech company per se. So they're telling some software shop in Ukraine or India or China "make it show graphs" and they make it show graphs, but the devs are not fish keepers, so the exact product reasons for certain things are getting lost in translation. Other examples are the graphs don't give the units they're measuring in... ppm? Maybe. Give them enough time, they'll fix it.
Their bigger problem is a lack of transparency. They don't have any forums or 'real' FAQs available. Their FAQ is a marketing FAQ. And maybe that's fine, many other companies in the industry kind of sneak by that way, like those snake-oil companies that sell magnetic 'water conditioners' (that do absolutely nothing). But it'd be bad if Seneye went that route, they really should be soliciting input to fix their product, and giving some insight into their process... Like when the new sensors will be available. Will the slides I have now still be useful then, or will I need to discard my current slides and use the new ones? That sort of simple thing, they just don't communicate.
I think it's basically a decent device, the PAR meter is worth it, the other sensors are substandard, but if it shows your pH dropping, your pH *IS* dropping, just don't trust the actual numeric reading, same for temperature, same for NH4, and probably same for the other parameters they say it will eventually support. It's not absolutely accurate, but relative, it's good.
Thanks for all the feedback.
After reading your experiences, I decided to do some testing of my own.
I placed a glass thermometer literally right next to the device, and matched up readings as often as I could. Mine seems to be reading pretty spot on. The last reading was 78.9 by the device, and the glass thermometer (the big one, cause I'm half blind and can't see out the rest) and it read just under the 79 degree mark. I compared several readings and got the same results.
I also decided to pull my Pinpoint PH probe (since my new calibration fluid just came in the other day) from the 75 gallon, re-calibrate it, and put the probe next to the device on the other side.
Again, I'm getting pretty close readings. My last reading was 8.02 and the Pinpoint read 8.06.
Free ammonia is tough to test against since the Seneye has read .001 since day 1, and my liquid titration tests come back at zero on the chart, I'm assuming that is correct as well.
Is there a possibility that you could potentially have a bad or damaged slide? If you'd like, I can reach out to my contact at Seneye and see if we can get that remedied.
I do agree with you on the front that they do not seem to have too much in the way of open format support. I have brought that concern to Seneye myself, and all I got from that was "we're working on something like that for the near future", whatever that means. LOL! But, Matt from Seneye did say that concerns, questions, etc can be posted and addressed on their facebook page in the meantime.
You can also access their offers to beta test new software when it comes out (theres actually one beta test going on now for a new version of the software), as well as fixes and updates to software when they are released through there as well.
As for the upgrade to the device with new tests, my understanding from speaking with Seneye is that the device will continue to function as normal, and when the new tests are ready, they will be available via new slides. So basically, once you run through the current stock of slides, you can order the updated slides and get the new testing parameters. I know that's not the perfect answer, but it is what I have at the moment.
Thanks again for bantering with me on this device! It's new for me, so getting as many opinions and suggestions on it are good for the process.
There is definitely some fluctuation, and a margin for error, but mine is pretty darned close.
After reading your experiences, I decided to do some testing of my own.
I placed a glass thermometer literally right next to the device, and matched up readings as often as I could. Mine seems to be reading pretty spot on. The last reading was 78.9 by the device, and the glass thermometer (the big one, cause I'm half blind and can't see out the rest) and it read just under the 79 degree mark. I compared several readings and got the same results.
I also decided to pull my Pinpoint PH probe (since my new calibration fluid just came in the other day) from the 75 gallon, re-calibrate it, and put the probe next to the device on the other side.
Again, I'm getting pretty close readings. My last reading was 8.02 and the Pinpoint read 8.06.
Free ammonia is tough to test against since the Seneye has read .001 since day 1, and my liquid titration tests come back at zero on the chart, I'm assuming that is correct as well.
Is there a possibility that you could potentially have a bad or damaged slide? If you'd like, I can reach out to my contact at Seneye and see if we can get that remedied.
I do agree with you on the front that they do not seem to have too much in the way of open format support. I have brought that concern to Seneye myself, and all I got from that was "we're working on something like that for the near future", whatever that means. LOL! But, Matt from Seneye did say that concerns, questions, etc can be posted and addressed on their facebook page in the meantime.
You can also access their offers to beta test new software when it comes out (theres actually one beta test going on now for a new version of the software), as well as fixes and updates to software when they are released through there as well.
As for the upgrade to the device with new tests, my understanding from speaking with Seneye is that the device will continue to function as normal, and when the new tests are ready, they will be available via new slides. So basically, once you run through the current stock of slides, you can order the updated slides and get the new testing parameters. I know that's not the perfect answer, but it is what I have at the moment.
Thanks again for bantering with me on this device! It's new for me, so getting as many opinions and suggestions on it are good for the process.
There is definitely some fluctuation, and a margin for error, but mine is pretty darned close.
I need to make a correction on this. Jason, you are in fact correct about the PH being off. My Pinpoint was reading "low battery", which inherently in the past has provided me with incorrect readings when that happens.
I changed the battery, and the Pinpoint is reading about 7.97 - 7.98, and the Seneye is reading 8.23. I have an email out to Matt at Seneye to see if he can shed some light on this for us.
I will keep you posted as to what his response is.
I changed the battery, and the Pinpoint is reading about 7.97 - 7.98, and the Seneye is reading 8.23. I have an email out to Matt at Seneye to see if he can shed some light on this for us.
I will keep you posted as to what his response is.
Yeah, seems to be the common problem... But fixable, I'd think - Either with software or a change to their slides. Everything else is just optics.
I agree. Ive been using this unit since december and have tested this thing every way possible(different areas of the tank/sump,new slides,different test kits/thermometers..etc) and the results are always the same...PH and temp consistently give inaccurate readings.However once they fix the software glitches it will be a very solid device. In the meantime its one of the best PAR meters available IMO