Start of my new 50b

[howze01]

So I have the tank and stand from Bax. I have a 700 gph Glass-Holes overflow, 20l sump and then a Sicce Syncra 5.0 and Reef Octopus 4 that I haven't ordered yet but will be within a week or so from Marine Depot and I am pretty sure I am going to go with 2 of the Amazon LEDs. So, I have a couple questions.

First, would 2 of the Amazon LEDs be overkill? Is there any way to use a dimmer with them if so? I have about as much electrical knowledge/skill as poorly trained Chimp so any help with that would be awesome.

I am hoping to get a hold of at least 1 MP10 but the person has 2 of them. Would 2 MP10s be too much for that tank? They are the non-wireless ones but for the price I'm OK with that. As far as I can tell the biggest difference is being able to run the 2 pumps in tandem. I would imagine that the same could be done just by turning them on a few seconds apart and just getting the timing right. Is that accurate?

I am also wondering about what you think I should be running as far as reactors. I'm sure I'm going to have to keep the PO4 reactor going since it seems that it will be a perpetual problem. I am also thinking of a carbon or bio pellet reactor as well. I'm pretty sure that the 1350gph from the Sicce will be more than enough for that and more if I decide to add in the future so my question is, bio pellets or carbon or both? It seems to me that bio pellets would be more beneficial and carbon would be easier to run in a filter bag or something along those lines if need be but I'm not too sure.

So, anything I am forgetting? I still have to figure out a layout of how I want everything plumbed but I am imagining it will be the GH overflow in the top left (or middle, depending on if I want 1 or 2 returns). Not too sure if I want to have a split return on each side but I am leaning towards just one for ease of plumbing/maintenance. I'm figuring the drain going to the left of the sump with the skimmer in that chamber, a baffle or three, a refugium in the middle and the return on the right plumbed straight up to the return. I'm not sure how reactors would work but thinking of a manifold but again, I never built one so ideas would be great.

Thanks for any and all help!

 

[TanksNStuff]

I don't know much about electric either, so I'll defer that question to the experts.

As far as the MP10's, they can be upgraded to wireless with the upgrade kits. I think they are around $85 each, but that will let you sync them up!

I'm sure you can get them at any VorTech dealer, but here's a link to one from Premium Aquatics http://premiumaquatics.com/aquatic-supplies/ET-MP269.html

If you have to buy both of them but find you only need one... I'm sure you could sell one of them pretty easily. In fact, I might be interested.

As far as carbon vs biopellet reactors... I've been told that you should run carbon for at least the first few weeks to a month when you initially use pellets, but after that you won't need carbon. I have a 1000ml container that I acquired at a very good deal ($20) so I plan to work it into my system eventually too. I'm just not sure of how to make the transfer from my gfo/carbon dual reactor setup. I haven't really had time to research it much. I've heard great things about it though, so it might be a good way to go when you first start out with the 50b.

If you want ideas on manifolds... I'll direct you to an NJRC member's thread which I think will help you figure some stuff out. Richie put together a pretty well thought out one that provides outlets for more than you would ever need. You won't need to build it as extensive as his, but any question you have will likely be answered in that thread. Not only that, but there's probably some good ideas on designing the sump in there too (might have to go back further than the post I linked to.)

Good luck and I'm sure I'll be following along your new ToTT thread.

 

[howze01]

Wow. A lot of good stuff there. Thanks George! I'm reading up on the whole bio pellet thing and it seems that the pellets help reduce both nitrate and phosphate. Would I need to run a phosphate reactor if I had a bio pellet reactor going?

 

[Fish Brain]

Sweet! I am almost done putting the 40B back together. I finished the plumbing today and I have water in the sump and the tank is 1/2 full. I should have it full by tomorrow and up and running with the G-H overflow.

I am running a SCWD on the 40 so I have 2 returns. I put the overflow in the middle and afterwords had a similar problem with the 65. With the center brace of the stand I had to plumb around it to get into the sump. I used one union at the top so I can disconnect the tank from the plumbing/stand. I also used a union at the bottom so I can direct the flow to either the skimmer section or the refugium section. I will update my tank thread and you can check it out.

I am just going to run a skimmer and bio pellets on the 40 and I'll let you know how that works out.

The nice thing about the MP-10's is that they are fully adjustable. I will be running two in the 65. The RF chip to sync them is $45 so $90 for both. I am not going to worry about getting them to sync with each other.

One is almost enough in the 40 so two in a 50/65 will be great plus with that return pump you will have a ton of flow.

 

[Fish Brain]

If you run pellets it is not recommended to run GFO for phosphates. The GFO can starve the bacteria of the nutrients it needs the remove nitrates/phosphates.

 

[redfishbluefish]

The best summary that I’ve seen on LED’s is found on RC in the DIY forum in a thread titled “DIY LEDs - The write-up.” If you go to page 200, post 4994, you’ll find the summary. HERE is an attempt to link that page….scroll down to #4994.



Now this summary is actually more for Cree 3 watt LED’s. The unit you are looking at supposedly has 3 watt LEDs running at around 2 watts. However, I think what they say in this summary is very important. To quote, here’s what they say about which LED and how many:

Which LED
The whole reason most of got into this light scheme was for efficiency. Having said that there have been a lot of question like will this LED work. The thing to look for is efficiency and spectrum. If the spectrum is what you want (matches the bulbs in there now) then you are fine. Most people have picked the CREE XR-E and XP-G LEDs because of their efficiency of over 100 lumens per watt. If the LED you are looking at is not over 100 lumens per watt you probably don’t want it.

How Many
The current recommendation is 1 LED for every 10-20 square inches of tank surface. Fish only could get by with the lower count, and a coral tank would need to be near the higher end. However if you take advantage of LEDs ability to focus corals could be spot lighted and cut down on the number of LEDs required.


I’m almost positive the unit you’re looking at in R2R is the same Chinese unit found at any number of retailers AS WELL AS ON AMAZON FOR HALF THE PRICE. Now I know as much about electronics as the monkey’s uncle, and so take this with a grain of salt. These units could be fitted with dim-ability but the cost would be in the $150 range for each one…..and you’d have to know what you’re doing. My feeling is if you want to be able to dim them (and get all the other bells and whistles), either buy the units with this feature or build the entire unit yourself. With these units you can “adjust” the amount of light by the height over the tank or the amount of “diffusion” you place between the light and the tank. I’m talking screen material or something similar.

You asked a lot of questions, and I've gotten a bit long winded, so I’ll answer one more…..reactors…..I really like the BRS dual reactor. I’m running GFO in one and carbon in the other. I agree that you could probably tee off your return pump to feed the reactor(s).

 

[TanksNStuff]

If you run pellets it is not recommended to run GFO for phosphates. The GFO can starve the bacteria of the nutrients it needs the remove nitrates/phosphates.

Yep my research so far agrees with that. However, I've read that if you're currently running gfo when you start pellets then you should run both for the first month. This is because it takes about that long for the pellets to start growing those beneficial bacteria. After the first month you remove gfo.

You likely wont need both if you start using pellets at tank startup because you wont have many nitrates or phosphates before the bacteria grows.

 

[shipwrecked]

*geesh* to think just a few mnths ago you were a newbie!! And now yr talkin reactors and mp10s and leds.You go buddy! Gd luck on yr build and when yr done I will pick yr brain and learn from ya.You make us proud young grasshopper

 

[howze01]

lol Tony! Its thanks to all the help I have gotten around here!

So it seems as though I will be able to start it off with just some Bio Pellets. Maybe someone said it already but is it OK or recommended to do Bio Pellets and carbon too? Should I just run Bio Pellets? Also, what kind of Bio Pellets should I run? I have read about the NP and I have heard good things about the Warner Marine ones (mostly from Daniel at the last meeting I was at). Anyone use either?

The plumbing on the 40b looks pretty sweet! I was thinking the same kind of setup but still am debating the split or single return. I guess with 2 MP10s even if the return flow is split and a reactor or 2 in the mix there would still be plenty of flow.

Thanks everyone for the help so far!

 

[shipwrecked]

I'd do the split...er.a...ok I did do the split..lol

 

[howze01]

I'd do the split...er.a...ok I did do the split..lol

Splits at your age??!! I'm impressed!

 

[Baxreefs]

Jonathan

Great to see your getting this off the ground!

I was told by Olivier, who knows a thing or two about electronics, that the Chinese LEDs are fitted with dimmable ballasts more often then not. Assuming they are, you can go to a DIY site like Rapid LED and buy one dimmer controller. One dimmer will control up to four channels, so you may want two controllers so one would be wired to the blue and one to the white LEDs of both fixtures combined.

I agree that if you've got a good deal on 2x MP10s grab them and you can always upgrade later. I think two is right and one is too lttle flow.

Are you drilling returns for the Syncra, or are you going over the top?

Do know dukey about running the pellets.

 

[howze01]

Thanks Bax! I was thinking that Olivier may be able to help with a suggestion or 2. I will have to check with him.

I was thinking of drilling the returns similar to what Brian did above with the flexible PVC but drilled not hanging. Was looking on GH where they have whole return packages. Was wondering what size returns I should do though. 1/2" or 3/4" are the packages they have. Really thinking that I am going to split the returns as well so the overflow will be in the top middle and the returns will be on either side of that.

Also, someone is selling a Bubble magnus nac 3+ skimmer. It's rated for 25-80g think that would be enough? The other I was going to get was the Reef Octopus 4 but I waited too long and it's not on sale anymore so I was hoping I could get the BM one instead since it's A LOT less.

 

[howze01]

So, got the Bubble Magus skimmer and ordered the Sicce Syncra 5.0 today! We're getting there! Hopefully going to drop the sump to Olivier tomorrow so he can work his magic. One thing I'm a bit confused about though. I am going with the standard 3 part sump with the drain on the left (with skimmer), refugium in the middle and return on the right. I looked at the link from the first page but that was a MUCH bigger sump than 20g and I'm still a bit confused about the manifold. For an in-stand sump how are they usually done? Where does the manifold actually go? I'm thinking I will just have the Bio Pellets and carbon reactors then the returns at the end which will then be split into the 2 returns. I think I'm going to go with 2x 1/2" return kits from GH as well. Soooo much to consider!!!! Any comments/better ideas?

 

[Baxreefs]

The Bubble Magnus skimmers are really solid performers. Dont push the NAC3 too hard in a 50g but it'll easily handle a light bio load.

As far as the diameter of the returns, 3/4 with provide less restriction if you're only going with two outlets. If your going with say four outlets 1/2 is fiine.

 

[howze01]

I figured to keep it pretty much the same load I have now. Really just want to add another clown for my Picasso and that's all. Of course there will be more corals but fish wise, that's it. Maybe a few more Sexy shrimp or another Pistol. I was actually thinking of moving a couple fish out as well. Not too sure yet.....

 

[Fish Brain]

With the syncra 5 you will want 3/4" returns. My thread was lost but here is my 65 with the G-H 700 and two drilled 3/4" returns.




Not sure what stand you have but if it has the center brace like mine does in the picture below. You can mount the manifold to the underside of that cross brace and run the plumbing up to the returns, and down to the reactors.


I think it was Trivan that had a nice manifold setup on his 45 cube, but again his build thread was lost.

 

[howze01]

Do you mean the center brace on the top or back? I guess other would work really. I was actually think of mounting it to the horizontal piece on the back. Looking at your pics I remember there was a reason that you offset the overflow but I can't remember what it was. What was the deal with that?

3/4" it is! Going to have to get onto GH and order up the return kits! Seems like I'm actually starting to get moving on this.... I can't wait already

 

[Fish Brain]

The reason the overflow is offset is because of the stupid center brace! I couldn't get the nut into the overflow box and there was no way to hold it so I could tighten it with the brace in the way. I'm glad I realized that before I cut the hole!!!

The vertical center brace could work also. I have my ATO, heater control, and RKL PC4 module mounted all over the inside back of the stand. I am thinking about moving the ATO and heater to the right side of the stand where I have my SL1 module and MP10 power supply mounted.

 

[shipwrecked]

Splits at your age??!! I'm impressed!

Thats if my cane doesnt get in the way