Freshwater ? *ducks*

[RichT]

I have a friend who just set up a 55g freshwater tank. It's been running for about a week now with no livestock. She said it is smelling up the house real bad. I was thinking it was kinda cycling or maybe there was some bacteria that's dying or blooming. She's added stress coat and has a double HOB filter going. Any ideas?

 

[mott768]

Rich it sound like the bacteria is dieing, do she have test kits ? have her check the water for ammo. she should do a big water change recheck if everything is ok then get a hardy fish like a tetra and add some carbon. or she can pick up a bag of bio spira freshwater and add that then within 24 hours check parr. if ok add a fish like a tetra.

 

[dflint]

I would just change a lot of the water; add a little food and let the filter run fish-less for couple of more weeks. If she is going to add a fish make sure it's a hardy one like a guppy, molly or other livebearer.

 

[mott768]

Guppies and mollies are not as hardy as tetra's they are more prone to ick during a cycle they do not handle stress as well, fishless cycles are harder to do with freshwater because there is nothing in the tank to feed the bacteria. I've had 19+ years experience with freshwater and the easiest way to start a tank is add a tetra like a snow tetra or bleeding heart do water changes once a week (depending on size) 10-15% until the tank is stable. Then add fish slowly 1 or 2 fish a week or every other week. You could also add a product called cycle I have had good results with it.

 

[mfisher2112]

Rich, I took care of this today. She came to see me. ;D

 

[ebqwert]

Rich

I agree with Mott... you need something in the tank to be part of the cycle... If all she has is water and plastic plants and gravel from a dry bag. there is no Bacteria other than what comes from the air.

add hardy fish slowly, test and change water.

Eric

and what's wrong with freshwater? thats how I started and I bet most of the others here too. I still enjoy my 90Gal Planted tank

 

[mfisher2112]

I don't like to add fish to my new tanks (I still keep fresh water tanks too).

I feed the tank. Very, very lightly. And I don't water change until the first cycle is over. A new tank that size would probably take me about 2 to 3 weeks to properly cycle.

Her water test was really wacky. Everything was all over the board.

Based on the list of chemicals she gave me, I think her problem was two-fold.

1: The crappy filter that comes with the "kits" (which I swapped out for her)
2: Bad chemical mixture in a brand new tank.

One thing I didn't get a chance to ask her was what she used to clean the tank etc with. I can't count how many people use dish detergent to clean decorations before putting them in the tank.

I told her to do a 50% water change (no livestock in the tank) and change out the filter with the new one. Come back and see me next week for another water change. And no more chemicals! ;D

 

[RichT]

Thanks for your help everyone!

Rich, I took care of this today. She came to see me. ;D

Thanks Matt. What did you end up telling her? Did she need the canister or was her current filters sufficient. I figured it was bacteria but didn't want to give bad advice as it's been 20+ years since I messed with freshwater.

and what's wrong with freshwater? thats how I started and I bet most of the others here too.

Nothing is wrong with it. It just makes good fodder for some ribbing. ;D

 

[RichT]

D'oh....snuck the answers in on me Matt.....
Thanks again.

 

[mfisher2112]

No worries Rich.  I really think that the little one in his eagerness to help has "assisted" her in over-chemicalizing the tank.

She used quite a bit of Water Clarifier, mixed with Stress Zyme and Stress Coat, and I think there was something else to bring down the PH.

Since there was nothing in the tank for the bacteria to break down, the extra addition of the stress zyme (which contains tank starting bacteria, as does the stress coat to a smaller degree) over burdened the system and the Top Fin filter couldn't handle it.

I swapped it out for a good aquaclear and some advice and instruction.  She has well water, so there should be no need for de-chlorinators or any kind of conditioning chemicals.  I personally avoid all chemicals at all costs, but do recognize the need for it on occassion.

She is going to bring me in her water again next week for another test, and we will go from there.

The good thing is that she has no fish or live-stock in the tank, so drastic water changes etc can be done with no adverse affects on the fish.

She also has a good plan to add fish slowly once the system stabilizes.  I think she may have over-reacted to a cloudy bacteria bloom by adding too much clarifier, and then following up with more doses of tank starting chemicals.

 

[RichT]

Eager is an understatement for Steven sometimes. Quite the active mind on that boy. He comes over with his mother and we have quite the discussion about my tank. I had no idea they actually went out and got it or I would have helped them out a little more. I think Grandmama had something to do with a spur of the moment purchase. To the surprise of his mother. Thanks again for going out of your way to help them.

 

[mfisher2112]

Hey, no problem. He was fun to talk to at least! Couple of years, and he'll be quite the aquarist! ;D

I enjoy helping people out who are willing to listen. Especially the young ones. I figure I can at leats help get them started right early! And since I know little about dog food, I spend a good deal of time in the fish department!

 

[kathainbowen]

She used quite a bit of Water Clarifier, mixed with Stress Zyme and Stress Coat, and I think there was something else to bring down the PH.

Since there was nothing in the tank for the bacteria to break down, the extra addition of the stress zyme (which contains tank starting bacteria, as does the stress coat to a smaller degree) over burdened the system and the Top Fin filter couldn't handle it.

:-\ I really couldn't recommend Stress Zyme or Stress Coat. There's really little good to them for the cost. For about the same cost, Kent, SeaChem, and Hagen make much better products. For dechlorinating, check out Prime (SeaChem) or Ammonia Detox (Kent). For bacteria introduction, check out Cycle (Hagen) or TLC products (specifically, TLC for Freshwater, in this case). For stress, there's Stress Coat (SeaChem) and ProTect Coat (Kent).

Sorry. Just my 2 cents from experience with all these products after many, many, many years of seeing just how "good" Stress Coat is (now that I've been able to play with so many other products- I will NEVER go back to Aquarium Pharmaceuticals. Not unless they made some big changes)

As per the scent, if the scent still lingers after doing some water changes, keep checking around. It could also be a subconscious reaction to suddenly smelling the humidity. Some people smell the humidity and believe it to be a foul smell. In fact, while the LFS I worked at never had that "fish store smell," we noticed a marked aromatic change after installing two dehumidifiers.

If still nothing works, you can also try the "Katrina Trick." I call it that because so many families returning to New Orleans after Hurricane Katrina were told by people who had already returned of how wonderful carbon filter media worked at helping to remove odors. They said it worked far better than baking soda. I sold out just about all my bulk carbon one weeked to a group of families returning to there so they could leave it out in rooms of their house to soak up the odor. Perhaps you could take a bag or two of carbon (like the Aquaclear pouches) and place them in the tank stand to soak up the scent like they did after Katrina? I know several people who swear by this trick.

Hope it helps.

If not.... you get used to it. ;D

 

[mott768]

Glad to hear she got some help and sound advise.... I agree with mfisher2112 100% I personally avoid all chemicals at all costs, but do recognize the need for it on occasion. The only thing I use for my freshwater tanks is start right and that is only used to treat my tap water for de chlorination. Good luck to them and hopefully they will have a enjoyable experience and eventually make a future mover to the wonderful world of salt.

 

[mfisher2112]

:-\ I really couldn't recommend Stress Zyme or Stress Coat. There's really little good to them for the cost. For about the same cost, Kent, SeaChem, and Hagen make much better products. For dechlorinating, check out Prime (SeaChem) or Ammonia Detox (Kent). For bacteria introduction, check out Cycle (Hagen) or TLC products (specifically, TLC for Freshwater, in this case). For stress, there's Stress Coat (SeaChem) and ProTect Coat (Kent).

Yeah, like I said, I try to stay away from ALL chemicals, especially in fresh water. Like Mott said, the only thing I would use would be a dechlorinator if it were city water, but she has well water, so no need for that.

I think she will be ok if she does the big water change and follows up with the better hang on back filter. I suggested that she could double up the carbon bag as well. I haven't found a benefit to the new "bio media" bag that AQ filters come with. I only use the sponge and the carbon.

I also introduced her to my favorite fresh water changer, the PYTHON! LOL! That thing is a GOD send! ;D

Hadn't thought about the himidity factor. Especially with so much dry heat going on with the weather right now. I will see her again on Thursday, so if the smell remains, I'll suggest a small bottle of carbon left open in the room. Good tip.

 

[kathainbowen]

[I think she will be ok if she does the big water change and follows up with the better hang on back filter.  I suggested that she could double up the carbon bag as well.  I haven't found a benefit to the new "bio media" bag that AQ filters come with.  I only use the sponge and the carbon.

Lol. I'm running the opposite of you, then. I love the bio media, but dump the carbon in favor of Purigen (I live with a well meaning person who likes to clean.... everything.... and who doesn't understand that aerosol and spray products could be potentially devastating to any tank, let alone a small tank).

I know, I know, before every gangs up on me: I know everyone says that the bio media is going to turn into a little nitrate factory from debris getting stuck in it. But, on the small scale, I have never had an issue with such a thing happening. It's a god send on the pico scale, but a definite nightmare on the large scale, when it comes to saltwater.

 

[mfisher2112]

Everyone has their own preference.  I have just used the AQs for so long, I don't see a need to change the way I do it.  As a matter of fact, I have been using a couple of my AQs so long that I can remember when the "ammonia remover" media bag was NEW!  LOL! You know, if it aint broke, don't fix it?   ;D  I am sure in freshwater there is some good about the bio media, But as far as Nitrate factory, I don't see that as an issue with freshwater.

I actually have a 30 gallon tank with a 6 year old discus running an Aquaclear with only sponge and carbon that I don't even do water changes on any more, except for the rare occasion.  But, that tank has been running since I moved into the house over 4 years ago.  I rinse the media in the filter, and if I start to notice anything "different" about the tank, I may change the sponge and/or carbon or do a little stone siphon.  But for the most part, she just gets topped off, and her tank is extremely stable.  I guess its important to note that I always oversize the AQ, though.  The 30 gallon is running an AQ70, not an AQ50, and my 10 gallon runs an AQ30.  Probably has a little to do with it.   ;D

 

[mfisher2112]

Hey Rich, just thought I'd let you know that I spoke to your friend (how bad am I, I still didn't get her name!) today, and the "smell" is gone. Seems the Aquaclear did the trick. I hate those dang Topfin crappy filters that come in those kits. Man do they suck.

Now, if I can just keep Steven from over-stocking the tank too soon.... Hmmm.... LOL

Right now he has a small (only 7) school of tetras and a pleco in there, but I think she is still showing a little too much ammonia count for my taste. I also think I got her to stop putting chemicals in the tank and the alk and PH has stopped bouncing all over the test kit range.

She should be good to go if she can keep him reigned in. But I think the grandmother came in the other day and bought him fish without her knowledge, so that's how the fish ended up in there so early.

 

[RichT]

That's good news the smell is gone. I havent' talked to her....btw Samantha, since last week. Seems grandmom is the one that needs reigning in.

Thanks again.