Last year I did not run a chiller at all and had no problems. But this year seems to be a different story. My temperatures are way above what is reasonable and I really need to get a chiller on the tank. Anybody have ideas for a diy that actually works? How about cheap commercial ones that are out there? My display is 75 gallons and I have about a total of 110 gallons of water, how big should I go for the chiller?
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Chillers, I need one bad, but have no money...ideas?
- Thread starter emanaresi
- Start date
Without money I am unsure of what to do, but if I had a tank that was about that size I would get one of these.
Sea Line 1/4 HP In-line Chiller
Good Luck..
Sea Line 1/4 HP In-line Chiller
Good Luck..
Thanks mynd, and Phyl, I am sure I will have to go with a commercial unit, but I cannot stomache the price for a new one. I guess it is time to start shopping for a used one.
1/6 hp is all you run phyl? I guess if I end up with a bigge3r one it will be fine, it just would take a shorter time to bring the temo down and then would shut down. Probably less eficient to do it that way though.
Thanks again.
1/6 hp is all you run phyl? I guess if I end up with a bigge3r one it will be fine, it just would take a shorter time to bring the temo down and then would shut down. Probably less eficient to do it that way though.
Thanks again.
Just curious, have you tried using a fan at all?
I was able to lower my temp a couple of degrees with a couple small computer fans blowing across the top of the tank. (90 gallon, brought the temp down 3 deg.)
Might be a cheaper option until you can find a chiller.
The evaporation from the tank definately increases with the fans.
I was able to lower my temp a couple of degrees with a couple small computer fans blowing across the top of the tank. (90 gallon, brought the temp down 3 deg.)
Might be a cheaper option until you can find a chiller.
The evaporation from the tank definately increases with the fans.
I just run fans now as my system is plumbed into the basement and fans and evap take care of the temps. I sold my chiller to Francis at the beginning of July. We hadn't used it in a year or more. I think it is actually more efficient to have the bigger one as it runs less and I believe they use less electricity to get you there.
I have 2 ice cap fans in the hood and a fan on the sump in the basement. However, I have not been running my air conditioner at home and the humidity is so high I don;t think I get as much evap as I would like to. I just got my dehumidifier in the basement fixed yesterday, so that should help to increae evaporation. I hope I don;t see 88 degrees when I get home from work today :-X
what if you'd put one of those plastic ice pack blocks in the sump? you could pick up a few and switch them out when needed.
I have no idea if it'd be a good idea or not to do that though, maybe someone else could chime in on that?
I have no idea if it'd be a good idea or not to do that though, maybe someone else could chime in on that?
here's some DIY plans, still costs ya a bit but you could probably check craigslist for the fridge or dehumidifier
http://saltaquarium.about.com/od/dyiprojects/l/bldiydonchiller.htm
http://saltaquarium.about.com/gi/dy...ts=1&zu=http://www.guarriello.net/chiller.htm
http://saltaquarium.about.com/od/dyiprojects/l/bldiydonchiller.htm
http://saltaquarium.about.com/gi/dy...ts=1&zu=http://www.guarriello.net/chiller.htm
That is a good idea phyl, I will throw a couple bottles in the freezer tonight.
I heard the coil in the dorm fridge really doesn't work too good.
Converting the dehumidifier looks like it would be right up my alley, but I don;t have a cheap dehumidifier laying around. I guess you could use a room air conditioner, take the fins off of the condensor, strap the condenser coils to a set of copper coils to make a sort of heat exchanger, wrap it up with some insulaiton and run water through the heat exchanger and through a titanium tube in the sump...very intriguing.
O hwell, hopefully with the dehumidifier back in the basement my temps will come down a little and I can rejoin the happy people who don;t worry about chillers!
I heard the coil in the dorm fridge really doesn't work too good.
Converting the dehumidifier looks like it would be right up my alley, but I don;t have a cheap dehumidifier laying around. I guess you could use a room air conditioner, take the fins off of the condensor, strap the condenser coils to a set of copper coils to make a sort of heat exchanger, wrap it up with some insulaiton and run water through the heat exchanger and through a titanium tube in the sump...very intriguing.
O hwell, hopefully with the dehumidifier back in the basement my temps will come down a little and I can rejoin the happy people who don;t worry about chillers!
emanaresi what is the average tank temp?
What do you consider high temps?
Do you have an air conditioner?
What temp is the air in the room with the tank?
Any idea what the relative humidity of the room with the tank is?
The two ice cap fans in the hood aren't really helping the tank per say but helping to keep additional heat from getting to the tank.
You could add another fan or two between the tank and hood where it will do the most good. Same with the sump (noticed you have one there already).
When using a fan you want to blow "lightly" across the surface and NOT directly at the water.
Unless you specifically have "cooler" reef inverts I wouldn't be to concerned unless your temps are getting over 83. Heck I don't even turn on sump fans until 83. Refuge fans at 84, cooler at 85 and killing lights at 86.
Almost all of the typical stuff most people have in their tanks grows best in 82-86 temp environments. The problem in an enclosed water tank is O2 depletion which gets worse the higher the temperature. If you're in the 84 range and holding another approach you could take is not worrying about the temp but the O2 instead. Just increase sump O2 levels. IE create waterfalls or anything that causes more turbulence at the water surface. In the main tank you could add another powerhead or rearrange the powerheads you have to cause more surface agitation. These all drive off CO2 and get more O2 in the water.
As far as melting ice. I don't remember exactly what the issue was but I remember hearing not to use soda bottles but milk jugs instead. It had something to do with the clear plastic.
If I still remember my chemistry correctly each pound of ice will give up 144 BTU as it melts. A 1 gallon jug will give up 7.6(lbs)*144=1094 BTU.
You get 1020 BTUs of cooling for every pound of water evaporated.... This is the Latent heat of evaporation. The means that for every gallon you evaporate, you get about 8500 BTUs of cooling. So for every gallon that evaporates, you will get around 5 degrees F of cooling in a 200 gallon tank.
Look at it another way....
A watt is about 3.412 BTUs per hour.
Lets say you evap 3 gallons in 24 hours... that is .125 gallons an hour... or 1 gallon every 8 hours. That 3 gallons of evaporation is equal to 25500 BTUs of cooling....
Or 1062.5 BTU/h which is of course 311 Watts/h of cooling.
We can also say that 125 gallons of water would be cooled about .3 degrees an hour with an evaporation rate of 3 gallons a day.
So as you can see evap and ice melting can definitely help some.
Carlo
PS if you want to try a DIY cooler don't bother with a small fridge. Go for a dehumidifier. They work much better! Also don't putz around with them unless you want to buy some titanium tubing (ebay) and will use that. Trying to use lots of cooled tubing in a separate tank just isn't worth the electrical expense compared to the conversion to titanium tubing dropped in the sump or other high flow area. It's easy to convert a dehumidifier into a cooler and moderate ones will works as well as a 1/6-1/4 hp cooler. This is from experience not from reading btw.
Carlo
What do you consider high temps?
Do you have an air conditioner?
What temp is the air in the room with the tank?
Any idea what the relative humidity of the room with the tank is?
The two ice cap fans in the hood aren't really helping the tank per say but helping to keep additional heat from getting to the tank.
You could add another fan or two between the tank and hood where it will do the most good. Same with the sump (noticed you have one there already).
When using a fan you want to blow "lightly" across the surface and NOT directly at the water.
Unless you specifically have "cooler" reef inverts I wouldn't be to concerned unless your temps are getting over 83. Heck I don't even turn on sump fans until 83. Refuge fans at 84, cooler at 85 and killing lights at 86.
Almost all of the typical stuff most people have in their tanks grows best in 82-86 temp environments. The problem in an enclosed water tank is O2 depletion which gets worse the higher the temperature. If you're in the 84 range and holding another approach you could take is not worrying about the temp but the O2 instead. Just increase sump O2 levels. IE create waterfalls or anything that causes more turbulence at the water surface. In the main tank you could add another powerhead or rearrange the powerheads you have to cause more surface agitation. These all drive off CO2 and get more O2 in the water.
As far as melting ice. I don't remember exactly what the issue was but I remember hearing not to use soda bottles but milk jugs instead. It had something to do with the clear plastic.
If I still remember my chemistry correctly each pound of ice will give up 144 BTU as it melts. A 1 gallon jug will give up 7.6(lbs)*144=1094 BTU.
You get 1020 BTUs of cooling for every pound of water evaporated.... This is the Latent heat of evaporation. The means that for every gallon you evaporate, you get about 8500 BTUs of cooling. So for every gallon that evaporates, you will get around 5 degrees F of cooling in a 200 gallon tank.
Look at it another way....
A watt is about 3.412 BTUs per hour.
Lets say you evap 3 gallons in 24 hours... that is .125 gallons an hour... or 1 gallon every 8 hours. That 3 gallons of evaporation is equal to 25500 BTUs of cooling....
Or 1062.5 BTU/h which is of course 311 Watts/h of cooling.
We can also say that 125 gallons of water would be cooled about .3 degrees an hour with an evaporation rate of 3 gallons a day.
So as you can see evap and ice melting can definitely help some.
Carlo
PS if you want to try a DIY cooler don't bother with a small fridge. Go for a dehumidifier. They work much better! Also don't putz around with them unless you want to buy some titanium tubing (ebay) and will use that. Trying to use lots of cooled tubing in a separate tank just isn't worth the electrical expense compared to the conversion to titanium tubing dropped in the sump or other high flow area. It's easy to convert a dehumidifier into a cooler and moderate ones will works as well as a 1/6-1/4 hp cooler. This is from experience not from reading btw.
Carlo
Thanks Phyl, got hung up on the other stuff and missed the lights.
You can also cut back on halides a hour a day during hot days also. If you have a timer you can turn off the lights in the middle of the day (cloud cover) for an hour or two and then back on again. If you don't want to outright reduce the lights an hour just do some cloud cover at the heat of the day and extend the lights into the evening or morning when the tank is normally cooler.
Carlo
You can also cut back on halides a hour a day during hot days also. If you have a timer you can turn off the lights in the middle of the day (cloud cover) for an hour or two and then back on again. If you don't want to outright reduce the lights an hour just do some cloud cover at the heat of the day and extend the lights into the evening or morning when the tank is normally cooler.
Carlo